Tm exclusive 

The modern game often makes cannon fodder of most football managers over a long enough period of time. Even the very best tacticians in Europe’s top leagues can rarely expect to last more than two or three years at a certain club. However, there are a few exceptions. For example, Pep Guardiola has been in charge of Manchester City for over 3000 days, while Diego Simeone is likely to break the 5000-day barrier at Atletico Madrid before he eventually calls it a day in the Spanish capital. However, in Germany there is a head coach with more longevity than both. 

Frank Schmidt, the head coach of plucky Bundesliga side Heidenheim, has been calling the shots at the German minnows since he was appointed head coach back in September, 2007. That means that Schmidt has not only been in charge for more than 6200 days, but has also guided the club from the fourth tier of German football right up to the Bundesliga. Schmidt & Co. overcame expectations with ease by steering well clear of relegation only to then grab a late qualification spot for this season’s UEFA Conference League. Ahead of the return of domestic football this weekend, Transfermarkt sat down with the legend of German football to ask him about his success at Heidenheim, the key to his longevity and what the 50-year-old tactician has planned for the next stage of his career. 

This interview has been translated and then edited for length and clarity.

Transfermarkt: Mr. Schmidt, what did you enjoy more: the Bundesliga promotion in 2023 or avoiding relegation and European qualification one year later?

Schmidt: I always celebrate the milestones as they come. For me, however, staying in the league was more important. Unfortunately, I was on crutches on the sofa during the summer break because of an ankle operation and had to enjoy the success differently. Promotion is one thing, but confirming your performance and finishing eighth is a step beyond that. And there’s one question you keep asking yourself…

Transfermarkt: What’s that?

Schmidt: How long can it go on? Where is the limit? We’re currently realizing how difficult it is to win games in the Bundesliga again. That’s why I don’t celebrate success outwardly as much; I feel more inward happiness. I have a strong winning mentality and really only focus on one thing: the next task. That’s what drives me.

Transfermarkt: You wanted to take a look at the table for the first time after ten Bundesliga games. After five matches without a win, you’re just outside the relegation zone. What’s your interim conclusion?

Schmidt: Wolfsburg was a pivotal game. If we had won, we would have been right on track. However, we can’t be satisfied with the recent results and are slightly falling behind. The pressure is naturally increasing, and we’re missing a few points. I know the discussions about the next top opponents. We are preparing ourselves for a somewhat bumpy road. But the team is always ready to push to the limit and give everything. The games were close. The past few years have always gone in one direction, so we must now come to terms with the current phase. It would be too much to expect that we only celebrate success continuously.

Transfermarkt: In the Conference League, you’ve managed to secure maximum points. Is success in Europe a risk for the Bundesliga because it can distract from day-to-day business?

Schmidt: My wife says: “You asked for it.” And of course, we accept it. What we are missing to some extent is regular training. Tactically, we can’t work the way we’re used to. Right now, it’s about playing, regenerating, sleeping, eating, preparing for the next opponent, and then playing again. That’s why I’m not unhappy about the international break. We’re not complaining but trying to make the best of it. It’s not easy for us at the moment, but our main task is to keep going.

Transfermarkt: Heidenheim has achieved something historic with promotion and qualification for Europe. You hinted at it: has the club now reached its peak potential?

Schmidt: That’s probably the case. In recent years, things have only gone in one direction. We’ve achieved something unimaginable, something nobody could have expected. But it would be wrong to talk about this as the final step. You have to align expectations with reality. If we stay in the league, that would be another big step. To understand this, just look at the second division. Many teams are expected to be in the Bundesliga over us.

Transfermarkt: You’ve been Heidenheim coach since 2007. How often in those years have you felt the urge to move elsewhere but then decided against it?

Schmidt: Not once. If I had felt that urge, I would have acted on it. Anyone who knows me knows that when I make a commitment, you can rely on me 100%. It’s not that things are always easy in Heidenheim. This could very well be the most challenging phase of my coaching career.

Transfermarkt: Why do you think that is?

Schmidt: We acknowledge that Heidenheim playing in the Bundesliga for the next ten years isn’t a given. That would be a misconception. For years, we’ve built success on player sales and signings from the second, third, or even fourth division. The expectation can’t be that this will automatically continue. The new players have great potential, but they still need to develop in the Bundesliga. Even after leading the table after the second matchday, I said: “It’s all about staying in the league.”

Transfermarkt: You probably had the right instinct.

Schmidt: It will be a brutal fight to the finish. I think everyone feels somewhat validated in this and would like it to be more comfortable. But we’re not in “make-a-wish” mode. At the end of the day, like in any company, there’s a balance sheet—and it has to add up. You get what you deserve. We are convinced that we will be above the line at the end of the season. If we finish 14th, as we are now, that would be a huge success. I can only promise that we will do everything we can to achieve that. Every year, anew. Because we can’t always go higher. Sometimes, we need to take a step back to move forward again.

Transfermarkt: What do you mean by that?

Schmidt: It’s about squad planning when key players leave. That was already a major adjustment for us this summer. We are still in the process of reorganising our attack. With the exception of Adrian Beck, Stefan Schimmer, Denis Thomalla, and Marvin Pieringer, everyone up front is new.

Transfermarkt: How worried were you that your successful team could fall apart, especially after the departures of key players Tim Kleindienst and Jan-Niklas Beste?

Schmidt: Many people around me were worried. But as a coach, I always need situations like that. When you’ve been at the club for so long, a shake-up is necessary now and then to reorganise. That’s my calling and what drives me. I have a huge desire and great respect for overcoming these hurdles. I have other things to worry about in life.

Transfermarkt: Talented Paul Wanner is currently in the spotlight, with the choice between the German and Austrian national teams. How do you perceive him?

Schmidt: He is incredibly mature and reflective for 18 years of age, with a clear plan. It’s not as if he asks me for advice every day. He already knows what he wants, together with his parents and advisors. A lot is coming at him, but we are very happy with him. He has developed remarkably as a person, but I think we can still provide him with additional tools. In the last few games, he’s struggled a bit, but that’s completely normal in his first proper Bundesliga season. He has immense potential and keeps both feet on the ground. If he stays injury-free and continues to progress, I am confident he can become an outstanding footballer.

Transfermarkt: You preach values such as reliability to your players. What type or category of player will FCH never sign?

Schmidt: Dishonest, lazy, or know-it-all types.

Transfermarkt: Has that ever happened before?

Schmidt: We are very good at putting together a squad because we know exactly what we want. Agents also understand what suits Heidenheim and what doesn’t. It’s not uncommon for us to consider a player, only to hear from their agent: “He’s not right for you.” It’s clear that not every player has the character or nature needed for Heidenheim. The dynamic must fit—the collective is the most important thing. While we don’t have a 100% success rate, it is very good. That said, there have been instances where it hasn’t worked at all.

Transfermarkt: After you turn 60, you claim you no longer want to be a coach. Do you know exactly when that will be?

Schmidt: No. What I can say is that I have a contract until 2027, which I definitely want to fulfil because we have always achieved what we set out to do. I never had a clear career plan anyway. But I can’t imagine being a coach until I’m close to retirement age like some others. On the other hand, I’m learning that I shouldn’t rule anything out. Dieter Hecking wasn’t a head coach for a long time and then suddenly returned at 60. I think it’s good not to have a specific date in mind to stop. I just know that I might want to do something else with my life someday.

Transfermarkt: Is there such a thing as the perfect time to leave?

Schmidt: It’s often said that you should leave when things are at their best. By that logic, I should have left after qualifying for Europe this summer. But that’s not who I am. I feel a sense of responsibility here in Heidenheim.

Transfermarkt: Would you consider a higher-level consultancy role in the future, like Jürgen Klopp and Red Bull?

Schmidt: I’d have to ask Klopp if he always had this plan or if it came about recently. (laughs) Football is, of course, what I do best, and my aim is to stay involved for as long as possible. I can see myself doing many things because I have a background in banking and experience working in a large company. Dealing with people who keep the organisation running with their performance—that’s my strength.

Transfermarkt: Let’s assume Heidenheim were to return to the second division in 2024/25. Would you still be on board?

Schmidt: Answering that question would take too much energy away from the day-to-day work, as it implies the possibility of relegation. I don’t focus on that. I can’t and won’t answer that question. (laughs) I’m sure the club has a Plan B, but that’s a question for our CEO Holger Sanwald, who oversees the club’s long-term planning.

Transfermarkt: You’ve said you could imagine a move someday. What kind of challenges or clubs would fit your ideal situation?

Schmidt: I’m not thinking that far ahead. There are still over two and a half years left on my contract. I can never expect things to be the same at another club as they are here. As a player at Alemannia Aachen at the old Tivoli, I experienced what it’s like when people identify 100% with their club and align their lives with it. That’s my world; I don’t need anything sterile or overly scientific. Where people show honest emotions, that’s where I belong.

Transfermarkt: A few months after promotion in 2023, you said: “There have been no offers in recent years anyway.” Hard to imagine after your successes…

Schmidt: That label was deliberate, and I wear it proudly. Holger Sanwald (CEO) once said: “Anyone can call me, but not because of Frank Schmidt.” If everyone supports each other through tough phases like this, we’ll overcome them together. I’m not someone who would say, after the next offer: “Everything I’ve told you so far was nice, but I’m leaving.” You can rely on me. Because of this, it’s been a long time since anyone enquired about me, and I don’t need that for my ego.

Transfermarkt: In your biography Unkaputtbar, you wrote: “I could have retired and led a quiet life—I was even close to doing so.” What stopped you?

Schmidt: After my playing career at Heidenheim’s ended, I promised my wife: “That’s it!” I planned to mow the lawn on Friday afternoons like my neighbours. I genuinely didn’t want to stay in the business. I had decided to pursue a completely different career path, away from the constant need for validation in football. Initially, I agreed to help out at Heidenheim for just two weeks—and I even helped find a new coach. I even arranged a job interview for one! This highlights how different my plans were. But I’m very grateful for how things turned out. I don’t think I would have been truly happy with my life outside football.

Transfermarkt: In 2017, you suffered a pulmonary embolism due to a prolonged muscle injury and were in a life-threatening situation. Does the football business allow you to rest, or do you always operate at maximum energy?

Schmidt: Both are true. I have full energy and recover quickly. Nevertheless, it’s a high workload. Currently, it’s particularly intense, especially with all the travelling we do. But I still have 100% power. If I ever realised I didn’t, I wouldn’t be able to do this job properly. I’ve even discussed this with my wife recently. After a defeat like the one against Wolfsburg, no one tells you the next morning what to do. You have to set the direction yourself, and that also requires energy. I’m not someone who does physical labour, but I do manage many issues and lead a team.

Transfermarkt: 2024/25 will likely require even more energy than usual.

Schmidt: This year will definitely demand more energy than any other period in my coaching career. But when you’re grounded and understand how complicated other jobs can be, you return to gratitude. I’m thankful to have turned my hobby into a profession. At the end of the day, it’s about a football game—not saving someone’s life on an operating table.

Transfermarkt: After promotion, you apologised during a press conference for the beer shower your celebrating team gave you. How much respect and decency do you see in professional football?

Schmidt: Respect is often discussed but quickly forgotten in a public environment where everyone has a say. Speaking for myself and the club, 1. FC Heidenheim’s history commands a lot of respect. However, if you look beyond us, respect often vanishes after the first few defeats under a new coach. Football is an emotional business, and you can’t weigh every word too carefully. There is no single truth. We all have to endure public scrutiny, and sometimes things can get out of hand. That’s part of the game. Anything else would be hypocritical.

Transfermarkt: You once said you want to open a tapas bar with a friend after retiring from football. What will help you more: your past as a banker or your experience as a professional coach?

Schmidt: That’s not yet a clear goal, nor is it being planned. It’s more of a pipe dream. I think, in the end, neither my banking experience nor my coaching career will help much. When you look into the hospitality business and talk to people, they often advise against it. So, whether it actually happens is hard to say.